21 Replies Latest reply: Feb 8, 2020 9:18 AM by koko RSS

    Can someone explain what happens if

    koko Active Contributor

      I got another funky email with another deadline telling me I had to

       

      Review and print detailed instructions here, a red dot will appear next to each step you haven’t completed.

      1. Go to the Payment Options page and click the “Add bank” button. You must add a bank account to each of your listings (tax forms may be required).
      2. Complete a Direct Debit Authorization form for each bank account.

      If you don’t complete the required steps by March 1, 2020, you'll receive future payouts after the traveler checks in.

       

      Now my question is:

      Of course I am on preferred payments and recent payouts took more than 2 weeks.

      And my settings are such, that the majority of the money is due at check in - an old habit from times when I collected the funds at check-in.

      So if I do not give permission for direct debit does that mean there can't be any charge backs? Does it mean HA cannot hold my money a week before transferring since the guest is already checked in? How does that work if I give DDA and HA decides to revoke my preferred payment status because I am saying something they don't like?

      Moreover I now get emails from VacationRentals.com (which I thought did not even exist anymore because they were sold) encouraging me to update my rates (which I did on 2/1/2020), telling me I had 108 page views earning me 1 reservation ( which I am not sure which one)!

      I for one have lost complete confidence in this whole set up.

      I see Verbo commercials running non stop and the leads are pouring in from Airbnb and booking.com. NONE from VRBO for months.

      How can I have faith to keep going when I have not even broken even last year with my yearly fees.

      This is one of my busiest times during the year and my calendar is FULL but not with VRBO guests.

      After 15+ years should I trust to invest more of my time and effort and energy into a little to no return venture?

      I do not want a to be a guinea pig for a large company's trials and tribulations.

      I know that this also will be a thread quickly being removed - but it expresses real issues I have no answers to - neither does CS. Who has them? Anyone guide me here?

        • Re: Can someone explain what happens if
          u0999 Premier Contributor

          no, not having direct debit auth does not mean there won't be any chargebacks. It means that you won't get paid. .Chargeback is initiated by customer via issuer bank, and it can happen to anyone at any time, and of course vrbo does not want to be responsible for those sums.  Since now vrbo is payment processor, they must have DD auth IN CASE of a chargeback  - or also if you decide to voluntarely refund of something, say an amenity broke and you decide to refund a certain sum to the renter.  Haven't you ever used a CC processor? they ALL require a DD authorization, not just Vrbo. I have been using Stripe from 2016, and I gave them DD authorization. You CANNOT operate otherwise if you take CC. This is not new nor unique to vrbo. I do not know why people make such fuss about it.

          P.S. they require DD authorization for each bank IF your money is directed to more than one bank (in your settings). Mine are directed only to one bank, so one DD auth (per property) for me.

          P.P.S only update your DD setting via dashboard (to be sure) , not by clicking any links in the email,

            • Re: Can someone explain what happens if
              koko Active Contributor

              Thank you for your insights.

              Yes I know that it does not mean that there can't be any charge backs - however HA sells it that way - here is a goody for giving us the authorization - why tie these things together when they have not much to do with each other?

              I was asking these questions because I process Credit Cards since 1994 - via Quick books, various processors, Stripe, PayPal, etc.

              All these companies were under Banking regulations. VRBO is a website who interjected itself into MY business. That's were the difference is. I am a customer to that website.

              Charge backs can happen, but that does not mean that I have to open my bank accounts to false reversals and incompetent accounting - and that should explain why the fuss!

              To the PS: true only one bank account is in question, but if your transfer out from there it will be also that account which can be tapped.........

              You get the point.

              If VRBO goes back to being responsible and reliable I have no issue, but  as of right now that's not the case I think we an agree on that one.

                • Re: Can someone explain what happens if
                  u0999 Premier Contributor

                  As you noted I am not necessarily disagreeing with you, I am just saying that essentially you cannot be listed on vrbo and NOT have a bank account with DD authorization attached/enabled. that is the short version. it is their "game" and they set the rules (however illogical and bad they are).  Now of course the choice is your whether to provide account and DD authorization, or to delist (or they will delist you eventually, if they do not have an account with DD authorization). By the way they need account whether payment is at check in or in advance. 

                    • Re: Can someone explain what happens if
                      beligiannisk New Member

                      Ok. And what can I do when the system does not allow me to fill a direct debit authorization? In my case I enter the page "payment options " and it says:

                      Direct debit authorization: not applicable!

                      I have asked them one million times what does it mean and what should I do and they keep telling me tgat their billing team will take care of that and I should wait for their update!

                      It's over one month now and I keep collecting tickets!

                • Re: Can someone explain what happens if
                  wildiris Senior Contributor

                  It behooves all owners to take a look at Vrbo's Terms and Conditions from time to time.  (I know, it's not exactly scintillating reading.)  Here's a link https://www.vrbo.com/legal/terms-and-conditions Pay particular attention to the "Accommodation Fee Collection Agreement" section.  Here's a relevant paragraph -

                   

                  1.5 Provision of Information You agree to provide us with all information and authorizations required by us or a third party service provider working on our behalf to access Your bank account designated on the Registration Form as necessary hereunder. You further agree to keep Your bank account information accurate and up-to-date with us and (ii) banking authorizations granted to us accurate and up-to-date with Your bank. Failure to do so may result in Payment amounts being misdirected, held by us pending confirmation, or returned to the Guests. Notwithstanding anything to the contrary herein, You will not be entitled to relevant Payment amounts under this Agreement unless and until You have provided us with accurate and up to date information as set forth in this section. We disclaim all liability for misdirected or returned Payments if Your information is not kept accurate. We may suspend or terminate this Agreement without notice if You fail to keep this information accurate or block or otherwise inhibit our ability to debit or credit Your bank account.

                  • Re: Can someone explain what happens if
                    hunterhaus Contributor

                    I would STRONGLY suggest against signing the direct debit authorization.  Read my horror story on this forum for an example.

                     

                    If you do sign it, make sure the account they have access to is used only to deposit the HA funds into.  As soon as you have them, transfer them out and do not leave a balance (except maybe a minimal balance to avoid bank fees).  Otherwise, you can end up like me, having deposits taken away 4 months after a guest had a perfectly fine stay.

                      • Re: Can someone explain what happens if
                        margaret CommunityAmbassador

                        Even if you sweep the account they will pull funds and you will have an overdraft.

                          • Re: Can someone explain what happens if
                            hunterhaus Contributor

                            I don't believe they can reverse an ACH if there are no funds.

                             

                            But what I'm saying is that if you have a dedicated account just for receiving payouts (i.e. you don't have any bills on autopay from there, don't use a debit card for that account) you can just freeze the account immediately if HA sends you one of these emails that there's issue with payment.

                            Luckily they don't move all that fast to do anything so you have time to protect your funds!

                          • Re: Can someone explain what happens if
                            u0999 Premier Contributor

                            I am sorry but that is bad advice. If you do not have DD auth, you will eventually stop being paid and likely your listing will be hidden. I am sorry they dug into your account. Your other advice about having dedicated account for HA payments is sound. But not signing a DD auth - not so much.

                              • Re: Can someone explain what happens if
                                hunterhaus Contributor

                                Its so weird - I haven't signed it, and I'm still listed.  Never received an email asking me to sign it.

                                I also haven't had a booking on HA since october, but my calendar is totally full from AirBnB.

                                 

                                Lastly there are a few comments here to the effect that 'this is how CC processing works' but AirBnB doesn't require a debit authorization...

                                  • Re: Can someone explain what happens if
                                    wildiris Senior Contributor

                                    For whatever reason, HomeAway is now asking owners to submit a specific debit authorization.  I don't remember HomeAway asking me to sign a specific debit authorization when the payment processor was Yapstone.  It was probably part of the "boilerplate" in their terms and conditions.  I bet the same is true of AirBnB.  Have you read through all of AirBnB's terms and conditions?  I bet it's in there somewhere. 

                                      • Re: Can someone explain what happens if
                                        hunterhaus Contributor

                                        This is what AirBnb has to say about possibility of debiting a host's account.  It is limited to 'payment processing errors' and will result in 'you receiving the correct amount'.  I am also not totally sure they'd be able to debit my account just based on this condition in the TOS, I feel like a bank would require an actual signed DD authorization and not some paragraph buried in a TOS.  But anyway, I feel much safer with the below language than what I've been hearing from HA (that they can't control chargebacks and that if one happens, they'll be the judge, jury, and executioner in deciding what happens).

                                        Homeaway's direct debit authorization is much more broad in its language, talking about " any amounts owed to Company, its affiliates or travelers"

                                         

                                        From AirBnB:

                                        10.5 Payment Processing Errors

                                        We will take steps to rectify any payment processing errors that we become aware of. These steps may include crediting or debiting (as appropriate) the same Payout Method or Payment Method used for the original Payout to or payment by you, so that you end up receiving or paying the correct amount. This may be performed by Airbnb Payments or a third party such as your financial institution.

                                      • Re: Can someone explain what happens if
                                        u0999 Premier Contributor

                                        hunterhaus Maybe because majority of Airbnb payments are disbursed upon check in or close to it. So they can take refunds out of monies held by them (not disbursed yet)  if they need to. Since you have not had booking from HA since October, this debate is strictly for the sake of debate? If you get a new HA  booking, the issue may be forced. As of now you may still be on Yapstone payments for all we know (hence there was no need for a new DD auth). Once Yapstone completely rolls off, it may come to this: provide DD auth or be hidden.  I personally (and I emphasize - personally) do not understand this big fuss over it. I use Stripe and they have DD auth. I am now switching to Lynnbrook and I am sure I signed for DD auth somewhere too. 

                                         

                                        wildiris "I don't remember HomeAway asking me to sign a specific debit authorization when the payment processor was Yapstone". well that was Yapstone, so why would vrbo ask you to submit debit auth? That would be between you and Yapstone. Once vrbo switches (or will switch) you from Yapstone to their processing, I am sure they will require a DD auth. I think it is because of this: if you have a renter, and you decided to refund them one night ( say to some issue), you would not be able to do it via platform unless you have a DD auth. 

                                          • Re: Can someone explain what happens if
                                            hunterhaus Contributor

                                            No I am not arguing just to argue, I am genuinely scared to take another HA booking due to this issue.

                                            I wouldn't have fussed over this either until homeaway threatened to take away an entire payment for a successful trip that was completed at my home 4 months ago.  It's nerve-wracking to say the least when a large corporation threatens to take away payment and is impossible to get in touch with to resolve the matter.

                                            • Re: Can someone explain what happens if
                                              wildiris Senior Contributor

                                              I'm not sure about the point that you are making - I think that you and I are actually in agreement. 

                                              u0999 wrote:

                                               

                                              wildiris "I don't remember HomeAway asking me to sign a specific debit authorization when the payment processor was Yapstone". well that was Yapstone, so why would vrbo ask you to submit debit auth? That would be between you and Yapstone.

                                              To the best of my knowledge, Vrbo has just replaced Yapstone with Hyperwallet as the payment processor.  So, perhaps Hyperwallet has asked Vrbo to obtain debit authorizations from the entities who list on Vrbo.  I recall, however, that when HomeAway first instituted "Alternate Payments" the boilerplate contained language authorizing HomeAway to debit my bank account.  My antennae went up at this and I never signed up for "Alternate Payments."  It is on this basis that I am hypothesizing that the "boilerplate" for HomeAway Payments (when they were being processed by Yapstone) also contained a debit authorization.

                                               

                                              u0999 wrote:

                                               

                                              wildiris Once vrbo switches (or will switch) you from Yapstone to their processing, I am sure they will require a DD auth. I think it is because of this: if you have a renter, and you decided to refund them one night ( say to some issue), you would not be able to do it via platform unless you have a DD auth.

                                              Yes - absolutely Vrbo is requiring this.  I have never said otherwise.

                                                • Re: Can someone explain what happens if
                                                  koko Active Contributor

                                                  So all this proves the point, that tying the Debit Authorization to Advanced Payments is not just deceitful but also a wrong premise.

                                                  HA telling me to give them something for something in return, when they have to have that something regardless of the return, which is by the way totally in their discretion even if I give them that something, is very typical of what this company has become.

                                                  As the situation stands right now, considering all the threads talking about HA's incredible incompetence of handling their customer's money, I would think that it would be really advantageous to get some official sounding response from the company.

                                                  That absent, along with the sharp drop in leads, seems to point to one thing: failure.